[Archived - Anarch] Issue with Head Expression Not Working Post-Upload

Posted by “Anarch” on November 08, 2023.

@Nums​ Ah, I now see what you mean! Thanks for the explanation. I've considered that, the only thing I don't like is how the open mouth morphs separate the top and bottom teeth and lower the jaw, which isn't the exact look I'm going for with the parted lips. Now that I think about it, I could always tweak each of these morphs just a bit, so that I don't break them completely but they still look like what I'm looking for when I play around with their combinations and strengths. Thank you for the idea

Posted by “Nums” on November 08, 2023.

Like here I used about 8+ morphs to create this expression on my head. Realistically parting the lips maybe could use something with mouth open, pucker, or smile, and possibly combine them? And yeah you can possibly tweak the existing one's into being able to morph into the exact look you're going for. That way you're not creating morphs specifically for a pose but rather what I think is the intended method and using the morphs together to create a look. As long as it comes default on your head, compatibility shouldn't be a problem I'd think.

Like here I part/open the lips in so many ways by just combining the default morphs together.

https://gyazo.com/580661d4896bf209f0c684c6769be2a4

https://www.imvu.com/shop/product.php?products_id=64705913

Posted by “Anarch” on November 08, 2023.

@MightySe7en​ I followed your advice and renamed the trigger to work, and reuploaded the .xpf for good measure, the behavior is the same - works only when I reupload the .xpf, and stops working upon upload. Could you check as well? (PID 65473823). To cross out something being wrong with a product along the derivation chain, I also tried deriving from IMVU's first head derivable - PID 59412, with the exact same results.

@Nums​ , thanks for your reply. I've been begrudgingly doing the "replacing less commonly used IMVU morphs" method but it just feels so limiting and I always dislike the fact that I'm essentially trashing perfectly good expressions for my own. It also leads to unexpected behavior with actions, poses etc. that may be using those morphs. What do you mean by "using the default head morph targets to create an animation of a look you want"? Do you mean just shaping the Basis/Face.average morph to the movement you want or something else?

Posted by “MightySe7en” on November 08, 2023.

@Anarch​ We looked into this a little bit and think it may have something to do with using blink as a means of getting an action to always play. Could you try naming the trigger then using that to get it to work just to test that the issue is with blink. You could also try using stance.Standing as a name but its possible that wont work in classic client

Posted by “Nums” on November 07, 2023.

I recently created my own head and couldn't figure this out either.

There are some morph targets that are basically unused. You could just use one of those in the worst case scenario until Classic client dies off lol

The other option , that I went with, is just using the default head morph targets to create an animation of a look you want. But that does require making multiple targets rather than just the specific one.

Posted by “Anarch” on November 05, 2023.

@MightySe7en​ thanks again for looking into this. What I really want to know is whether there's a method I've overlooked to successfully display custom head expressions across all IMVU platforms/clients. This could indicate an issue with my current workflow. Alternatively, if this limitation is intentional, does this seem to be a Classic quirk, which makes Classic treat these type of expression morphs differently (and whether this has to do with them having names other than the default). From this article, I find:

"IMVU has a centralized morph control system. This means that although you may be able to make your own emotion morphs in the 3D files we supply, those morphs will not show up in the live IMVU product. This is due to our having exported our heads with a given set of morphs. Although we do not currently support user created emotion morphs on the IMVU created heads, you CAN make your own heads with morphs that match the names on our heads."

For some reason, IMVU Studio (and, by extension, IMVU next?) didn't get that memo, because it manages to display the expressions correctly. It's also interesting how IMVU Classic initially displays the expression when I first upload the .xpf but then something between that point and the product upload point blocks/sanitizes it.

Posted by “MightySe7en” on November 05, 2023.

@Anarch​ we can look into the issue and see if we can find a solution. It is very possible there won't be an easy solution but I will keep you updated with what we find

Posted by “Anarch” on November 05, 2023.

I forgot to add that I tried saving(reuploading) that same product using Studio, but in Classic the lips remain closed.

Posted by “Anarch” on November 05, 2023.

I downloaded Studio, and the expression works there without having to reupload the .xpf! When I edit the product in Studio, the lips are parted, just like they should be. When I wear the product in the Classic Client though, the lips remain closed. So Classic is somehow breaking the functionality. Is there a way to fix this?

Posted by “MightySe7en” on November 03, 2023.

Ah I see the morph now, I didnt notice it since it didnt have any motion.

Would it be possible to have you try setting this up in Studio and seeing if anything changes? Tomorrow I can try doing the same thing in classic client as well to see if they makes a difference for me.

Posted by “Anarch” on November 03, 2023.

@MightySe7en​, thanks for troubleshooting with me. Can you see the .xpf I uploaded to the action? I basically want to make a head that has a permanent, autostarting, parted lips expression. The action is named "blink" as an easy way to get the action to auto-start as soon as someone wears the head (because avatars are always blinking). I've done this countless times with previous heads, but the .xpf's I used with them contained IMVU's default morph names (like blink.Left.Lower.Clamped, for example, etc.). This time, I created a new shape key with parted lips and added it to the head's shape keys in Blender, named it "mouth open" and then manually wrote the code for the .xpf - I just gave the morph a weight of 0.57 that was closer to the look I was going for.

By the way, I'm not using cal3D, I used .fbx import too, and I'm using IMVU Classic.

I just don't know why the expression works fine when I add the .xpf to the action, but when I save and upload the product, it stops working everywhere including the next time I edit the product.

I realize that an alternative way is to not use an expression altogether and just have a head with parted lips as a Basis mesh, but I was hoping to be able to work with expressions because it would save time for me for future heads I make streamlining the whole process, and also opens up more possibilities for experimenting with custom expressions.

Posted by “MightySe7en” on November 03, 2023.

@Anarch​ I looked at your product and didnt see the morph you were talking about, just a blink action. I did go ahead and make a product of my own by taking the avatars head, adding a new blend shape to it, keyframing it in an action, then importing it to the Female Head scene. After publishing it, I was able to go into a room on IMVU Desktop and the action worked.

I used fbx and I am sadly not too familiar with using cal3d exports.

Are you working in IMVU Studio or classic client?

Posted by “Anarch” on November 02, 2023.

Hi and thank you for looking into this @MightySe7en​, the PID is 65473823.

Posted by “MightySe7en” on November 02, 2023.

Hi @Anarch​ , can you share the PID so I can look in the scene and see if I can notice anything wrong